May 19, 2023

112: How to Avoid Entrepreneurial Bullsh*t: A Candid Convo on Sleaze, Collabs, and True Crime with the Hosts of Pass The Bullsh*t

112: How to Avoid Entrepreneurial Bullsh*t: A Candid Convo on Sleaze, Collabs, and True Crime with the Hosts of Pass The Bullsh*t
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Are you falling into the copy-and-paste culture of online business building? Are you drowning in marketing "shoulds" doled out by gurus and one-size-fits-all peddlers? Are you sick to death of collaborations that take more than they give? And - speaking of death - have you ever taken business inspiration from true crime detectives?

In this special episode, Annie P. Ruggles is joined by Crystal Tosh and Amy Hartmann, co-founders of So True Digital and hosts of the unapologetically fabulous and sometimes scathing podcast, Pass The Bullshit. Their insights are not to be missed if you're feeling turned off by the lack of honesty, transparency, and, frankly, decency in the online marketing world, and you wouldn't mind having a laugh or two along the way to freedom.

Parentpreneur advisory: This episode contains colorful language throughout. It is not recommended for tiny ears.

- Connect with Amy and Crystal through their website
- Befriend them on Facebook: Crystal & Amy
- Don't forget to check out their podcast, Pass The Bullsh*t
- Annie's free masterclass, "Make Selling Easy Without Getting Sleazy" is available free without opt-in here.
- Need to get yourself "unboxed?" Be sure to follow Alison Arnoff on LinkedIn.

What's Inside:
00:03:21 - Authenticity over Content,
00:07:19 - Fear of Being Yourself,
00:10:15 - Permission to Do It Your Way,
00:16:25 - Your Brand is You,
00:19:36 - Avoiding DM Spamming,
00:24:04 - Networking Like a Human,
00:29:35 - Greetings and Authenticity,
00:38:26 - Peanut Butter and Jelly Your Zones of Genius,
00:48:49 - Lessons from True Crime
00:53:50 - Embracing Obsessiveness,
00:57:37 - The Company You Keep,
01:05:23 - Scrapping Your Way to Success,
01:06:46 - Partnering for Success,
01:12:43 - Homework for the Week: Let's Get Real

Wanna binge? Check out these related episodes:
59: On Influence, Ethics & Buffy the Vampire Slayer (feat. Johnny Ball)
68: On High-Ticket Selling, Integrity & The Lion King (feat. Isaac Ho)
75: On Relationship Marketing, Visibility & Survivor (feat. Angie Trueblood)
80: On Expertise, Unlearning & The OC (feat. Rachel Kurzyp)
101: On Bro-Marketing, Manipulation & Andor (feat. Josh Elledge)

00:00:00 Or like this one happens to me all the time in my, you know, long damn, they'll go, so I see that you're whatever. How are things going? Okay, where's mediocre start here. How are things going? And then I'll be like, great. 00:00:11 Things are great. And they'll say, great. How much money did you make in your business this year, and what are your goals for the future? Damn. Time me. 00:00:20 Dinner first, please. My God. You. You. 00:00:30 I'm not giving up without a fight, and I'm not leaving till I wake up too quick. 00:00:55 Welcome to too legitimate to quit instantly actionable small business strategies with a pop culture spin I am your host, Annie P. Ruggles. And my guests that's right, guests plural today are the incomparable Crystal Tosh and Amy Hartmann. Now, they have many, many accolades, each to their name. But when combined, Crystal and Amy are the co founders of So True Digital. 00:01:22 At So True, they work closely with their clients to create a comprehensive gotomarket plan that takes into account their clients unique value proposition, target audience, and competitive landscape. They help their clients identify the right channels to reach their audience, craft compelling messaging, and build a stronger brand identity. They also co host one of my absolute favorite podcasts in this space, the Unapologetically Fabulous Pass the Bullshit, where they tear down the not so great parts of running an online business, especially one without ethics. It's a delight to have them both in the studio with me. So let's just jump right in, y'all. 00:02:05 It's a tltq first. That's right, a twofer. That's right. It's a threesome today or whatever number, y'all. Full disclosure, I'm coming off of some COVID, so your trusty host here is spinning out just a tad. 00:02:21 But I'm still super excited for the first Tltq twofer, where I get to ask Crystal and Amy, what do small business owners need to focus on this week? I think that they need to focus on having conversations online. Let's let go of content creation and figure out how to talk to people in the online world. 00:02:47 And in those conversations, can you just be yourself? Quit trying to be some persona and some bullshit like that. Just be you. And if you can be you, you'll attract people who you want to work with. Quit worrying about all the audience and you got to figure out your avatar. 00:03:04 Just figure out yourself. That's what you need to focus on this week. Figure out who the hell you are. Look at that. We are 1 minute and 11 seconds in, including my preamble. 00:03:14 Bumbling. And look at this. We're already on. Screw your avatar. Know thyself. 00:03:21 Okay, that is amazing. As a former content marketer who still very much believes in content marketing, can I say hallelujah? Preach. And please say it again louder for the people in the back, because one of the things that I've seen in the kind of copy and paste culture of online business is that we're putting so much pressure on authenticity and then we're turning around and saying, you need to be authentic, but follow this formula to the letter. Yes. 00:03:55 And one of the main places we see that is in content marketing, where I'm like, oh, I can tell what Swipe file went out this week in the B School emails because I got those from everybody. Right. The exact strategy has got to go, right? Exactly. So I love this idea of if you put yourself out there as you something that I've seen the two of you do, like in the pre chat, I was like, hey, Crystal, how is being upside out in your post the other day? 00:04:24 We pay attention because it feels like actual social media. It feels like there's a person on the other side of this thing and not just a brand. And it's tough when you're living your personal brand, especially if you're a one person shop or a two person shop, to not kind of fall into that housing. But how do we just take the opportunity to showcase ourselves as ourselves? And is showcase even the right word? 00:04:57 Like, what should we be doing online? Honestly, the big issue that we have is all this exact strategy stuff. But even more so is this idea of these content pillars. I think that out there in the world, we're all creating these pillars which are holding up our house and we're staking our entire business on them. And the question that we ask our clients at So True has nothing to do with pillars, it has to do with anchors. 00:05:21 What are the conversations that you want to have? Where are you going to put your anchor today so that you can go fishing? Right. And that's how you bring out the authenticity. Nobody ever goes into a conversation with someone and goes, let me think about my content pillars today. 00:05:34 They're like, no, let me think about the conversation I'd like to have with someone. Right. So that's how we pull it out. Yeah. And I love the way that you said, this is where I want to put my anchor today because, wow, we're going into an extended fishing metaphor, but schools of fish travel, and so can you. 00:05:56 Right. Another thing that I feel like we got so mired in is like, I am currently known for this thing and therefore if I can't use that hashtag, I will not talk. And it's like, okay, but every now and then you got to move your boat. Yes. I can't say yes enough to this. 00:06:18 And it's been something that Amy and I have felt for a while and we were really struggling with how do we say this in a different way and really encourage people that you don't have to be stuck. I feel like people just create these pillars five years ago in their business and they've changed, and their business has changed and they're not happy and they're so scared to just pivot a little bit, just move the boat. You've got to fish somewhere else. Like, you've worn that out and you have grown like, good Lord, it's a journey to be an entrepreneur. So you're not the same person you were five years ago, so change the. 00:06:56 Conversation you're having and your audience is changing, too. Yes, we're all growing up, some of us more intentionally than others, but yeah, our taste is evolving and our savvy is evolving and our learning curves, hopefully we're progressing like we're on that roller coaster. 00:07:19 Just back to the freaking fishing metaphor. Your boat is also just going to drift naturally, and that's okay. Let it go. Fishing is not today's pop culture topic, everyone, but when a metaphor works, we stick to it around here. So why do you think we hold so tightly to our two inch corner of the Internet? 00:07:47 Go ahead, Crystal. I was going to say because some coach told us to, and we're so scared. We're so scared to be ourselves and to trust our own genius. I think that coaching is wonderful. Amy and I talk about it on our podcast. 00:08:02 We'll talk about it here. But I do think that this exact formula be a carbon copy of me is a huge problem because people are too scared to just be themselves and do it their own damn way. 00:08:18 Coaches out there really are teaching this idea that you should niche down so much and that you should be this one thing. I once heard a coach, I don't even remember who it was, but they said, you have to be a stump before you can be a tree. And I thought, that's a terrible thing to say to people. You don't have to be a stub. Okay, also not our pop culture topic, but those people are what I refer to as the Giving tree people. 00:08:46 And I hate that book so hard because it's that same, like be a stump. No, I don't want to be a stump. I did not quit my job and my four hundred and one k to be a fucking stump. Okay? Yes, well, and I think about it in a sense of a stump is usually after you've cut the tree down and you know you're doing stump removal because it's not ever going to grow into a new tree. 00:09:15 You're just this weird thing that's taking up space in the yard that nobody wants to look at. No, I am a cactus. I am misshapen and bumpy and awesome and sharp and kind of pretty like twice a year. Like, I am a cactus and I do not move. I am not a stump. 00:09:34 Right, but no, I think you're so right because this word should keeps coming up. And lately in the end of 2022 and 2023, now I'm making my grand return to doing more one on one consulting. And what's really interesting, because I don't put myself out there as a marketing or funnel expert at all. What's really surprising is that people are coming to me almost for permission to market things their own way without shoulds. Because always in the deconstruction of figuring out what they want, they'll bring up somebody's really fixed opinion and be like, well, I have to put it on you to me. 00:10:15 I have to, I have to put it on you to me. I have to do this, I have to. If it's not on Kindle, I'm going to die. If I don't have a 17 part email sequence to the number, I'm like, y'all, let's shake off some of these shoulds and just do it your way. Because what I think people are scared to admit is that these do, as I say, exampleings, are not the easy button they're promised. 00:10:43 And that means that there is no easy button. And that means that we're always experimenting, no matter if we're following a formula or not. So I feel like we're afraid to just admit that, yeah, okay, doing it my way is scary, so doing it at all. And I think that all of these fear tactics out there, like, I have to do it or this way or it's not going to work if you don't do it, my exact strategy, it's not going to work. I think those are fear tactics that just keep us in the fear of being ourselves. 00:11:12 And honestly, if you let go of the fear of being yourself and you just be yourself, you'll attract people to you who you enjoy talking to and who you enjoy having in your business and in your life. And as long as we're trying to do somebody else's thing, we're going to attract their people, and their people may suck. So basically what I'm hearing is that entrepreneurship is middle school. Yes. Oh, my God. 00:11:39 Yes. 100%. It is like middle school. Let's go back to 1996. 00:11:48 And I'm 38 years old, but, you know, like, I'm hearing this and I'm laughing, but part of me is like, well, fuck, could someone go back at a time machine and tell little twelve year old Andy Pasnisi that if she just sits at her own table and doesn't cry in the bathroom, everything would be like, fine, stick up for yourself. Be yourself and people will like you? I think that's such a sad but true example of like, I was so desperate to fit other people's molds in grade school. Like, so fucking sad. But I actually passed around a list at one point, being like, things I Would Change About Annie. 00:12:25 Please fill in. Yeah, sad. Trauma. Trauma. But I say that to be to say, don't do that. 00:12:35 In your business, feedback is important. Knowing your people, their avatar, what they need from you, sure, that's important. But at the end of the day, if you're sending around the Things I Would Change About Annie list, you're disrespecting your brand more than any possible R and D value you could get out. Of that exercise well, and you can't. So here's my thing about all of these cookie cutter. 00:13:04 Be like me and you should do this and you should do that. We can only fake it for so long. If you're like me, a complete ADHD hot mess and I'm supposed to be this polished, organized person the rest of my life, I'm going to fail. Like, give me three months. I might be able to keep it up. 00:13:23 And then I'm going to crash and burn. And then I'm going to question myself and my genius and everything about me, and I'm going to be sad and depressed because I put myself in a box someone else created for me. And I think people just need permission to live outside the box. Like, unbox yourself and just be you because there's somebody else out there like you. That's the beauty of humanity is I promise you'll, find your people. 00:13:48 I was told like five years ago by this clothing I don't know, clothing consultant, image consultant that you should never wear black. So I tried not to wear black, which is my favorite color. Yes. Literally my entire closet is black today. Like a floral print. 00:14:12 And my glasses, these two roll in like Wednesday Adams. Well, that's me. I am Wednesday Adams. And I was told I couldn't be a successful entrepreneur if I didn't embrace all this BS. And so when I said, screw you. 00:14:26 And I wear Chucks every day, I literally have about I'm not joking 15 pairs of Chucks. I wear one pair of them. Like, every day. I rotate, and I wear black every day. I am happy. 00:14:37 I feel good. I feel confident. And you know what? It's part of my brand. People now know me as that. 00:14:42 They send me pictures of Chucks. Like, do you have this bear? I get the same thing with bow pumas. No, I didn't put the bows on myself. They come that way, and I have them in every color. 00:14:53 And when we are in Tulsa together, you will see I wear big girl shoes for about 10 seconds. Yes. And then I put on my bo pumas, and for the rest of the week, I will be in my bow pumas. And people now will send me stuff, being like, wait, do you have the blue pair with the leopard bow, or do you just have the blue pair with the stripey bow? And I'm like, thank you for your concern about my feet. 00:15:14 I'm so thankful, right? But, like, you can make a brand out of anything. It doesn't have to be like, everything for so long went rose gold and cursive. And I was like, can we get away? I like rose gold as a concept. 00:15:28 I like cursive as a concept. I wish it was still taught in schools. That being said, like, if everybody's brand is rose gold, and cursive. Why aren't we just wearing black? Like, come on. 00:15:40 Oh my gosh, that is so good. So I love these people who are like, the branding just dropped. It's always cursive. There's always some cursive to it and like some other it's two fonts. One always cursive, always changing our branding every day. 00:15:58 Right. I don't get it this morning and become a new brand, be yourself, show up the same way and quit with this. Like, my new branding dropped. That's just ridiculous. I'm just going to put that out there too. 00:16:10 Well, and you are your brand, right? Yes. Like, Amy Hartman is your brand and Crystal Tosh is your brand. And then together you have the joint entity of Crystal and Amy which relies on the two of you showing up as Crystal and Amy. Yes, exactly. 00:16:25 Right? Like, it'd be a really funny day if one day you all recorded an episode where Crystal pretended to be Amy and Amy pretended to be Crystal. It would probably work in a really beautiful way, but in a bizarre way that should never be repeated. That could never work. But I feel like when we're changing our branding up, we're changing our clothes. 00:16:46 We're not changing who we are. Yes, exactly. It's really hard to keep changing all the time. And it's also really hard to keep up with remembering the persona that's been created to attract the audience that you've decided that you're supposed to be attracting because your coach told you to. It's really hard to keep up with and to remember. 00:17:05 It's like trying to remember all the lies you've ever told. It gets really hard. Yes. Oh, God, you're like and my twin sister's name was Tabitha. Tabitha. 00:17:22 Yes, Tabitha. 00:17:26 But no, it is like keeping your lies straight because you got to look at you're got to constantly be shapeshifting. Who am I showing up as? And it's not natural to you. Whereas in selling, I tell people all the time, what roles are you naturally selling in? Are you a parent? 00:17:44 Are you a tough sister? Are you a former corporate boss who wants to burn it all down? Are you a truth teller? What are these different roles that you play where you're selling now? But those are current roles that you currently play in your life because you birth something or did something, right? 00:18:02 It's not putting on this new outfit. It's not putting on this Rose gold incursive. And being like, I'm an elite coach now. Right. Or I'm going to read this sales script that makes me sound like a robot. 00:18:16 Or an asshole. Or an asshole. Or an asshole. Yes. I'm going to come into your DMs and pitch you real quick. 00:18:26 Okay, let's talk about DMs. I think this is important because when you are showing up as you, you are going to make professional friends and I spend an obscene amount of time on LinkedIn Messenger. Just yes, you do. You're a LinkedIn pro? I am. 00:18:49 Thank you. But, like, you and I today, you were like, hey, we don't have a link. You send that to me on Facebook Messenger. You sent me a DM. Now, granted, we had had a prior conversation over there and I literally could work it like a cocktail bar on LinkedIn all day because I just talked to my folks over there all day. 00:19:10 And then I'm like, oh, wait, show me your post, boop. And then it works, right? But there's earned intimacy and then there's rushed intimacy and fake intimacy and all of these things. So if we're showing up as ourselves, give me some quick and dirty tips on not DM spamming people, but allowing yourself to be accessible and present and open to conversation. How do we navigate that? 00:19:36 I mean, every conversation since the beginning of all time has always started with a question. And the issue, I think, is that we pick up the phone and we go, hey, how are you? Or, hey, it's now a good time to talk, right? These are our natural conversation type things. It's like, always started that way, but because that's the box that we put ourselves in. 00:19:55 People show up in DMs and they're like, hey, do you want to buy my thing? Instead of like, hey, how are you? Start a conversation. And I am the queen of if you DM me, I am going to follow this DM with you. So anybody who comes in and spam DMs me, oh, we go far. 00:20:15 We go real far and we go deep. And then we go back and talk about that on the podcast and I share all the dirty details of everything they did wrong because I freaking love it. Come at me with these things because it is the most fun I can have in my life. Meanwhile, I just leave them on red. Amy has she's like the person that answers the telemarketing call and screws with them, but she does get the DM me. 00:20:41 I just hang up. But Amy loves it. Have you all seen the Ted Talk where the guy responds to spam emails? No. He's like, I am a Nigerian prince and I need your help. 00:20:54 He's like, thank you so much for reaching out to me. I have contacted Interpol. They are triangulating your location and your rescue mission is on the way. 00:21:06 Our people will be like, do you want to make a million dollars by next Tuesday? And they'll be like, specifically, next Tuesday. Could it be Monday? I really need money now. They go back and just poke, poke, poke, poke. 00:21:18 Right? But I have yet to do that on LinkedIn. But damn, I want to because all right, cold prospecting, DMs or otherwise, three marketers are going to break this down for you. Aka, don't do it. 00:21:33 I went to Columbia College, Chicago, which is an art school, and I got a Cold Prospecting email and they doubled down on this three times. I got the same email three times that said the subject was Go Renegades. And I was like, the fuck So I open it up and it's like, hey, we see that you are a proud graduate of Columbia College Chicago. That's true. I am. 00:21:57 Go Renegades. I'm like, what's a renegade? We have a sports team. Apparently, in the 20 years since college, columbia has gotten, like, a frisbee golf team, and they're called the Columbia Renegades. And this whole email was, like, hardcore leaning on, like, if I had gone to Notre Dame. 00:22:20 And they're like, Go Irish. And I'm like, sure, okay, I get that that would work. But also, do you not realize that the degree right there says musical theater performance? Like what's? The Go renegade. 00:22:34 What? Right? And then I got the same email again, like, hey, check it in, Renegade. I'm like, stop using. And also, what do you do? 00:22:42 Like, if there's a Trojan, but like, hey, Trojan, what are you doing? What do you do? No, that is fake intimacy where you Googled me quickly. You looked at my profile instantly to figure out which of your cold emailing hooks to use, and you didn't actually look at me at all, right? Like, I got another one the other day, a DM on LinkedIn where they literally took my weird LinkedIn bio with, like, the pointing emojis and were like, based on your work as a pointing emoji founder, non fleecey sales academy pointing emoji host, you legitimate to quit. 00:23:22 I'm like what? Now we're just copy and pasting this shit? Like, come on. So if you're showing up as you would you back to that idea? Would you you as an actual person send this message to another person? 00:23:40 If you would not do this, then why are you doing it? Like, look at it and say, would I, Annie, want to make a friend with someone and go up to them and be like, hold on, let me Google their college team real quick? Like, no, you would not. If anything that happens in the wild, right? Oh, God, I could talk about this a bit. 00:24:04 I feel like the question too, isn't would you send someone a message like this? But would you walk up to them in person? Because all social media, all of this is all a big networking party, right? So think of it as, like, networking party. Would you walk up to someone and say the thing that you're saying to me right now? 00:24:22 You don't and you don't Google people if you don't know them at a networking thing. You're not like, let me go over here and Google you real quick so that I can say something smart. You walk up and you ask them about themselves, and you tell them about you, and you act like a normal freaking human. Dates like a damn human already. Oh, my God. 00:24:38 When we're together in Tulsa at success becomes me. We really need to do that. We need to be like, oh, hi. Hold on, let me Google you really quick. Let me pull you up in the Hoover app and be like, okay, you're from Tallahassee. 00:24:55 I saw a show about someone that got murdered there once. Cool. But also or the other thing is I want to go up to someone so bad and take their name badge lanyard thing in my hands and then be like, I see that you are the founder of read it to their face as speaker. Like, I see that you are a speaker at this event. Like, really? 00:25:26 Okay. Or like, this one happens to me all the time in my long damn. They'll go so I see that you're whatever. How are things going? Okay, we're mediocre. 00:25:39 Start here. How are things going? And then I'll be like, great. Things are great. And they'll say, great. 00:25:43 How much money did you make in your business this year? And what are your goals for the future? 00:25:51 Buy me dinner first, please. God, does a free joint come with that conversation shit? Did you send me free drink, like, through DoorDash something? My God, we don't have to rush intimacy again. Would you do this in real life now? 00:26:14 Some people are creepers. Yeah, some people really come on strong. I am one of those come on strong creepers. Like, I don't send professional emails ever. I send the emails that Annie writes. 00:26:26 So the emails that Annie writes are often shouty and super emotional. And the story I keep telling is on the Danielle Weil episode of this podcast. I just got this brand new AI tool for podcasters called Capshow, which I totally adore, but Capshow can't read tone, and so when I'm interviewing people, I'm like, oh, my gosh, you're so freaking brilliant. Right? That's how I am. 00:26:54 And so Capsho picked it up for my show notes and was like, today on the episode, danielle Weil, a beautiful and brilliant genius, is here to talk about email marketing. And I'm like, almost like but at least it caught the fact that Annie is very loving and effusive with compliments. It didn't just be like, Daniel Wild, email marketing strategist. I'm like, can we meet in the middle? Can we come together and have a little bit of the flavor, but not the cheesets with the extra cheese on top, which aren't really all that good. 00:27:33 No, they're not good. Well, and I think that people just forget that just because you're online doesn't mean you have to show up like a robot. Like, you can just be yourself online. Just like Amy said. You wouldn't go up to somebody in a room at your local networking event or meet up, or maybe you're just like at an event, just bump into somebody. 00:27:56 You wouldn't act like a complete weirdo. You'd be like, oh, my gosh, excuse me. I'm so sorry. Well, yeah, I see. Oh, I'm crystal and you're blah, blah, blah. 00:28:03 Then you would just start talking to each other, but it wouldn't follow like some formula. That's what makes it weird. I'm telling you, I can't wait. We're going to breed. Do not be listening to this episode. 00:28:14 Because now I'm like, I just want someone to ask me a question and then I just start dancing, pointing. They're like, Annie, tell me about what you think of your opinion on this thing. And I'll be like, okay. And I spin in a circle and start pointing. Well, also, when they send you their answer, could we go, hold on, let me see what my script says. 00:28:36 I'm supposed to say next. Yes, that's the next thing. And it never follows a conversational flow because conversations, they can't be planned out ahead of time. You can't do both sides of the conversation, right? It's ridiculous. 00:28:51 And also, just back to your point about you don't send professional emails. What the hell is a professional email? Like, email was intended to be a back and forth exchange between two human beings, right? There's no such thing as a professional email. 00:29:05 Stop that shit right now. Well, we had a client whose email for new people who signed up to the list literally said greetings. Like, greetings. Hello. We're from Earth. 00:29:16 How are you, Earthlings? I mean, it was the weirdest freaking thing ever. And this is supposed to be like. A cool, really cool place. So we caught that and said, that's a strange way to introduce someone to your new list, to being on your list. 00:29:35 Greetings. How are you? Greet. I don't even remember. I just know it said greetings. 00:29:39 And it was like, could we just let that go? Can somebody send an email that says, I hope this email finds you crappy? 00:29:50 I mean, if you're going to sell me something, you want me to be acutely aware of my problem. So why are we hoping that the email finds them? Well, I hope this email finds you stressed out and ready to spend money. Yes. 00:30:07 Greetings. Oh, it's good. So good. Greetings, everybody. Your homework this week is not to do this, but bonus homework. 00:30:16 I want you to all start a conversation today with the word greetings. Greetings. Yeah, just walk up to somebody and. Say greetings, and they're going to be like, hello, where are you from? Jupiter? 00:30:26 And then, yeah, maybe that should be it. Maybe we should all have to say our emails and social media posts to other humans this week to be like, is this a natural thing that people do or say? Oh, God. And it's not that this stuff doesn't work. I'm not throwing all content marketing under the bus. 00:30:50 But if you're putting up a glossy front on top of a brand that you're trying so hard to grow, you're just adding a hurdle that you don't need. If you are the unicorn out there who actually says greetings, if you are. A fabulous little Mr. Tumnus amazing, mythical being thing. Then A, you belong on TikTok with all of the wizards and fairies over there that I adore, and B, then you got to be like, Greetings. 00:31:25 Yes. That's a thing I actually say. Like, if you're going to say it, then double down for sure. And people would know that about you anyway because you're already saying it to everybody. And that's the thing that's about being yourself, is just do what you naturally do and don't try to make up special things like, don't try to come up with, I have to have the perfect tagline and the perfect whatever. 00:31:45 It'll come to you when it comes to you. No shit. My bio on Facebook literally says I'm allergic to bullshit. And people tell me all the time, you're the same person online as you are in person. I'm like you don't say yes. 00:32:00 I am myself. Yes. What you see is what you get. I don't trust is exhausting. It is. 00:32:08 That's all the more reason why you're going to wind up with professional friends that you wind up having really dorky conversations with on LinkedIn Messenger, because you're just out there like, the me you all know is the same me my husband knows is the same me my parents know. It's the same me my clients know. Yes, there's nuances, right? But not that much. I'm pretty much a WYSIWYG muppet. 00:32:32 Like, this is it. I have two modes. I have on and I have off, and the people that are close to me know the off mode better than my clients do. But the on mode is the same for everybody, right? So I think that's really key. 00:32:49 Okay, so how do we weather the slings and arrows of public opinion when you are showing up fully as yourself? Oh, I just think that you just can't give a shit. Because here's the thing. If you are actually being yourself and being a forward thinker and not trying to emulate everybody else, you're going to say some things that people don't agree with. And great, you've started a whole conversation and now you get to have a conversation with people and you get to be a forward thinker. 00:33:21 You get to be someone who has their own ideas and you don't have to keep going back and double checking with other people to make sure you're okay. Right? I think thought leaders don't ask for permission. So if you want to be known in your field or whatever as a thought leader, then you actually have to double down and stand behind what you believe. And that's always going to come with friction. 00:33:45 There's always going to be people who don't agree with you and you just have to be okay with it. I do think that for women especially, I feel like we try to put ourselves in these boxes. And I'm from the south, so I'm from Kentucky, and women just are expected to sit in this box and wave and have a pretty smile. And you have to be willing to just be like, I'm going to burn this bitch down and I'm going to be myself. And whoever likes me, likes me, and whoever doesn't, they're just not for me. 00:34:13 And that's fine. But good Southern women also know how to say, bless your heart, so bless all their hearts and let them go. 00:34:23 Yeah. I'm from the fake south, aka Missouri. So we try to try on things like bless your heart, and instead we know we can't pull them off. So the Missouri version of that is we just make passive aggressive noises like, she did. Oh, she did, right? 00:34:48 It happens all the time. I'm like, wow, that noise is the bitchiest thing I do. I'm like, if I'm grumbling to myself, I have opinions that I am trying to keep in. 00:35:03 They just come out as noises. Right. Reflect your heart. And that's true. We only throw shade on shiny shit. 00:35:12 Yes, it's Women's History Month right now. Like, quiet women don't make history or whatever that shit is, right? But no, it's definitely true. I love the way you put it, Crystal. Thought leaders don't ask for permission. 00:35:27 Thought leaders just do. And then to Amy's point, they got to back that up. Yeah, right. Like, if you're going to stand on that hill, you don't have to die on it, but at least don't just stand there for a minute and then move on. It seems antithetical to what we said at the beginning about content pillars, but it's not. 00:35:47 That's your anchor. If that's you, some shit's not going to change, right? How you say it, what tagline you put on it, what cursive font you choose may change or evolve, but at the end of the day, your brand shouldn't be changing due to the fact that you're a wildly changing person. We're all evolving, but this goes back to the very beginning. Know yourself. 00:36:11 If you're showing up disingenuously or inconsistently in terms of your public persona, then that means that you've crafted a persona instead of you. Yeah, amen. And why are we asking permission of other people? Like, they're more important than us. Like, I have to go get someone else's permission to show up as myself. 00:36:32 What made them more important than me? In this world, everybody is equally important. And you are allowed to take up space and you're allowed to have thoughts and opinions, and nobody else's thoughts or opinions are better than yours or more valuable than yours. So just say it. Say the damn thing. 00:36:52 I think that we get so boxed in because we think that these people that we put on pedestals know more than us. And again, I've found I've been an entrepreneur for a hot minute, like seven or eight years, and I have found that the people that I used to just like, oh, my God, fangirl over and think that they had it all together. They are human. And when I got close, in close proximity to those people, I realized they're not the same people that they portray online. They have crafted a persona, and they aren't who they say they are, and they have to keep it up because they are not confident enough to just really be themselves. 00:37:33 And I think that that comes back to almost like bait and switch. And then you've crafted yourself in a way of like, oh, I have to be this person, because this person's like that. And then you only find out that they're fake, and you're like, well, shit, maybe I should have just been myself all along. Well, and then you climb to the top of the pedestal that people put you on and realize you don't want to be there. Amen. 00:37:59 We all as people in this industry, we keep receipts. We know who the hidden, unhappy folks are, and there's a lot of them. And it's scary when you're just starting out because you're looking for positive modeling and you start to see that maybe some of this is veneer, and you're like, wait, can anyone do this and be happy? Yes. The people that can do this and be happy are the people that are honest and loyal to themselves. 00:38:26 And don't just start a giant conference because people told them to, right? Yes. Or start or sell a course because someone told them to. Or create a mastermind because it's the trendy fucking thing right now. Like, whatever it is. 00:38:46 Amy and I can speak to this a little bit. We thought we wanted to do something, and for six months we've tried forcing it, and we wanted to be for everyone and create this space. And I'm not saying it was a bad idea, but the writing was on the wall. No one respected it, and it was a time suck and energy suck for us. So we had to make the decision to say, well, we tried and no more, and there's nothing wrong with that. 00:39:11 Yeah, we didn't respect it ourselves because it wasn't where we wanted to be, and it's not really serving who we are meant to serve because it wasn't aligned to who we are as human beings. And so, again, it goes back to making sure that you're doing what it aligns to, who you are too, and what you most love to do and how your brain works and who you want to be working with and what you want to do every day and day. So how do you round these parts? I'm a big fan of Gay Hendrix, the Big Leap, and the idea of the zone of excellence versus the zone of genius. So my question to the two of you is you both have mastered, although it takes time to ebb and flow and blah, blah, and all the shit we've talked about, but you both understand who you are and your individual zones of genius. 00:40:04 So when you find something like that old project that might be in your zone of excellence, you're good at it, but it's not aligned. My question for the two of you is, as a duo, how do you peanut butter and jelly your individual zones of genius to create something new? How do you two as a team honor yourselves and each other's zones of genius? In collaboration? We are so unique and in ways that complement each other so well. 00:40:38 And so it actually works really well because Crystal is the person who is out there talking to everyone. She has never met a single stranger in her whole entire life. And that's where she shines. That's what she loves to do. And I am like a really big nerd. 00:40:55 I love to be in the background of things. I love to put together everything. Our business is so well organized. I love to manage our team. I love to do all of those pieces. 00:41:03 So we will have an idea together and she'll get out there and start telling everybody so that we can start getting that social proof. And I will go straight into, let me create this. Let's get it all together. Let's figure out the nitty gritty of it. And so working together, that has been the most beautiful part of our partnership is that we compliment each other so well. 00:41:21 That's awesome. And you know your own lanes, right? I think in collaboration, that's so easy. Is back to the freaking grade school. My God. 00:41:31 Everybody's got the group project memory where you did all the work and everyone's got the group project memory where maybe you didn't do your full share. And so we all carry that with us of like, okay, when I'm collaborating, I have to bring the most to the table and it's like, no, you just have to bring your best and then honor the commitments you make. Right? Like, know your lane, know your responsibility, know your energetic share of it. Make sure that's been clearly communicated. 00:42:00 Right. I think Amy and I did a podcast a little bit about partnerships because sometimes they get a really bad name. I mean, I've been told by coaches in the past, don't ever partner with anyone, but the truth is, most of us end up hiring someone to help us as our businesses grow in some way because we are not good at everything. If you are good at everything, you are actually not great at anything. 00:42:28 I know for me, I have suffered from this and Amy can jump in here and probably say yes. I'll sometimes send text message to her and say, oh, my God, I feel like I'm not doing enough. I need to be helping you with this techie stuff in the back end. But honestly, if I got in there, I would screw it up more. I am so not that person because for whatever reason, my creative genius is not linear. 00:42:52 I can't think of the steps, like, if I am doing it, having a conversation with someone and quote, selling. Because actually selling is what I've done my whole life, but I never really knew that it was selling because it just feels so easy to me because I'm just sharing a love for something that I know can change them. And it just seems like a conversation to me. And they just say, yes, and we move on. But the steps of, like, okay, now they need to do this and fill out this form and go here and have this. 00:43:19 My brain just doesn't execute those steps properly. So it is also being nice to yourself and being like, that's okay. It doesn't mean I'm not bringing something to the table, because I am everything to the table. But then our meetings together, so our weekly meetings where we come together and evaluate what's going well, what we need to do differently, ideas come up during those. They're so much fun because in that way, our brains work a lot alike. 00:43:48 The ideas that spark the way that we think through marketing, the way that we analyze human behavior and people and the people on our team and everything we talk about, those are the most fun meetings I've ever had in my life because of what's happening in them. And it's just this back and forth within that zone of genius. And then we also have our own unique zones where we go into after those meetings are over, it's like we don't even want to talk about the marching orders. That's our thing. I do my thing, it all works out. 00:44:16 And it's beautiful. It's gorgeous. It's gorgeous. 00:44:25 That is the positive version of that. Yeah. The tone is just a little yeah. Just a little different. Just MMM. 00:44:35 Oh, I love that, though, because all right, we can all get lost in partnership. Yes. I understand the motive and the inspiration behind you getting should on that. I have definitely had some partnerships that were not advantageous, but I think also to your example, Crystal, what are we calling a partnership? Every partnership doesn't have to be starting a business or starting a podcast with someone. 00:45:07 Hiring someone is partnering. When you two work with a client, you're partnering. When I teach someone how to sell, I'm partnering. We can't just be like, don't partner with anyone. Okay, what are you supposed to do as an entrepreneur? 00:45:20 The next time someone comes like, hey, do you want to be on a summit? You're like, Get away from me. 00:45:28 How do you do this without your people? I understand the risk. But when you're looking at how you two are talking about showing up responsibly and balanced and knowing yourself and knowing your roles and understanding how to support each other and that sometimes one of you is going to have to do 51% and then the other one's going to have to do 51%, understanding all of that. We got to open ourselves up to connection or we'll die. Yeah, I think that comes back to the human piece. 00:46:03 I think something that Amy and I do beautifully is we are both like ADHD and we have all the ideas and literally we think about monetizing something constantly. Neither one of us can have a hobby. But what's beautiful is I can tell when she's having a week, right? Like whenever it's not her week. And so then I do try to step up a little more and try to do some other things. 00:46:28 Like maybe I'll send out the emails or try to make contact with these people and do some more of the tedious tasks that maybe I don't do. And then she knows. And this is again, knowing each other and this kind of vibe. I know vibe is like a trendy word, but we can feel each other's energy and she knows when I'm having a shift and we're women and so depending on the month, there's different things going on or maybe there's life things that come up. And what has been so beautiful, I think personally about this and it goes back to also partnering with just like someone you hire, you need to have that really good fit, forget about their qualifications. 00:47:08 Do you vibe together? That matters. You can teach all the things, right? I can teach you to do tasks, but do we mesh together? Because that is what's going to get you farther is being able to kind of read and intuitively know this is not her week or this is not her day and I'm just going to give her permission to go do what she needs to do and know that the business is going to keep going. 00:47:30 Yeah. And Crystal and I met in a coaching program that was going horribly wrong, but anyway, off the rails. The coaching program was going off the rails, but she and I met there and within a month we had started our podcast and like a few weeks after that we went and stayed in an airbnb together to plan our business together. I mean, that was the perfect opportunity to be in a house with a. Murderer we never met in person. 00:47:58 Transition to today's culture topic. Oh my God. Okay, so you didn't get murdered though. You went to an airbnb and neither congratulations to both of you on successfully not murdering the other one or being murdered. So y'all what? 00:48:18 Collaboration, showing up, being yourself, intuition, dropping the shoulds toxic coaching, any of that. What does that have to do with true crime? I mean, other than like if you trust your gut, trust your gut. And also if you do partner with someone, like maybe meet them in a public place before you sleep next to them, but up to you. It worked out well for us, but it was like the intuition of knowing and I think that's true. 00:48:49 If you should feel into your intuition, if something doesn't feel quite right, don't go forward with it. And that's the beauty. If you watch True Crime, then that's what you should take out of that. It's like, know your intuition, because trust. It, because you know what? 00:49:03 I've had other partnerships. I think Amy's done this too, and they didn't work out. So I could have stood in that like a stump and said, no, Amy, even though you're freaking amazing and everything in my bones tells me we could kill it together, I'm going to stand on this hill and die. That partnerships will never work because I have a past experience that went bad, maybe a past couple of experiences, but instead I was like, I know that this is the person I've needed to find my whole life. Like, there she is. 00:49:36 She's right in front of me. I can either choose to go or I can stand here on my stump. Yeah. And then there's times when you have to be willing to take the risk and know that not everything is a true crime. Not everybody's out to kill you. 00:49:48 Right? Not everybody's out to kill you. We're not. But also what I love about true crime is that it actually does have an exact strategy. Like, if you want to be on true crime, like, if you want to end up on a true crime show, there's like, two things that you can do. 00:50:06 There's exactly a strategy. You can never meet a stranger. So, like, Crystal, she's great for true crime show. I am. I'm right there. 00:50:14 And if you light up a room, you're done. 00:50:21 I never want to light up a room. Never. Don't give Keith Morrison any reason to say you're the life of the party. You light up a room or you have an infectious laugh if you say that you're fucked. Exactly. 00:50:34 So this is a place where an exact strategy does work in true crime. If you would like to get murdered, then you may have an exact strategy to light up rooms and never meet strangers. But you know what's so interesting about all of that too, is, like, I absorb a phenomenal amount of true crime, and a lot of them are one detective centric. But it's never just that detective. And to your point, even on the fictionalized ones, there's a Risoli and there's an aisles, right? 00:51:13 Detectives have partners or captains have teams. And so one of my favorite shows, Cold Justice with Kelly Siegler, she doesn't just go in there on her own and be like, I am Kelly. She will literally go to the detectives in that area and be like, I need you to time me up so I could see how I would have to struggle to get out of this. And they're like, okay, Kelly, let's just do it. Right? 00:51:37 But then she's got her forensics people and she's got her big picture people and she's got her scientists, and she's got the people that are really awesome at talking to the family. Like, she's got support for her zone of genius. It's not just her. Even though one way to be on a true crime show is be a detective. That is a no nonsense weirdo compared to other detectives. 00:51:59 Yeah, but you're still going to bring people with you. Right, but that no nonsense weirdo is being themselves to be able to go out and do what they do best, and they never let go. Right. That person never lets go. Like, this is their thing that they're going to do, and they're going to solve this problem, and they do it just by being themselves and deciding that they're digging in. 00:52:24 I think that's such a great point because especially on the cold case shows like Cold Case Files and Cold Justice and these things, it requires out and out lunatic levels of tenacity to show up and try to solve the same murder every day for 30 years. Yes. And the way that they do it, anytime you see someone who's showing up in that tenacity, and the family is, like, crying because they love them, they're like, he never gave up on us. Right. But the thing on that is that they feel a strong sense of duty to see something through, and yet they have to be flexible. 00:53:09 How many times have we seen a show where they get really pigeonholed interested on one suspect and they follow that one suspect for, like, ten years, and then it turns out it was like a freaking HITH hiker came through and they were like, we could have solved this ten years ago if we hadn't been so rigid. And it's like, yeah, you could have. Right? So we got to trust our instinct, but we also have to let ourselves grow and adapt. But. 00:53:36 Also, I think entrepreneurship. We could learn a lot from that sense of duty. Like, I promised myself I would do this, and I got a YouTube hater, and I'm still going to do it. That DNA came back inconclusive. Go find some more. 00:53:50 Right. Keep going. I think resiliency and tenacity are the two most underrated things that entrepreneurs talk about. Or I think that doesn't get a lot of light because it doesn't sound sexy talking about being an entrepreneur for income and freedom and time and whatever it is, like your travel life. But let's be honest, you have to be really resilient because it's an up and down. 00:54:20 Like, one week you're on top of the world and everything's falling into place and blah, blah, blah. And the next week, shit's on fire. Yeah. And you have to figure out if it's arson or faulty wire or if someone fell asleep smoking. Yeah, exactly. 00:54:37 You have to investigate for all of the above. Okay. That's a freaking phenomenal. The curiosity and the investigation of all these armchair detectives that we all are when we watch True Crime, right? We're all trying to catch the detail that we're like, I knew it was going to be that weird red string. 00:54:57 Why are we not getting that boldly investigative about our own experiments and processes? Why are we not applying that same I'm going to figure this out tooth and nail energy to things like, how do I have a launch that works? Well, get really fucking obsessed with it, right? Apply. That true crime energy. 00:55:20 Put your weird string board up with your postits and get it done. Like, get weirdly obsessed with what you're doing. That's how cases get solved, and that's how money gets made, I guess. And do it more than once. Do it? 00:55:36 Yeah, I was going to say do it more than once. So the postit notes on the wall reminded me of the airbnb that Amy and I spent the weekend in. Because that whole airbnb, we moved furniture to make a wall of postits. And then we were like and and then we looked at it on the last day and we're like, fuck this one. We just took it all down. 00:55:53 We had all this shit that was all planned out. And we were like we just sat there on the couch and looked at it. And we both looked at each other. And we're like we turned the couch around. We literally picked it up and turned it around so we could look at Facebook. 00:56:05 And then we went and we had these big paper things with postits all over them where we would, like, drew out our whole business. And then we were like, yeah. No, if one of you had murdered the other one, that would be the first thing. Like, the airbnb host, like, the owner would be like, the couch is backwards. Why is the couch backwards? 00:56:27 Why has the couch been moved? And yet we again, don't apply that to like that LinkedIn post went viral. Why? Right? Why? 00:56:36 Right? Like, that client adored me more than any other client I've ever had. Why? What did I do right? We want to focus on I think everybody wants to focus on what doesn't work. 00:56:50 So what went wrong? Okay, asshole, what went right? Actually, there was something that worked in some way. Like, just for 5 seconds, look at it and flip the script and look at it. Like, what worked? 00:57:02 Why did this person really love me? But what most people think of is why did the seven people hate me? No. Why did the one person just why is she shouting your name from the rooftops? Go figure that out and recreate that. 00:57:14 And treat the other way. Magnificently. Treat her like she lights up a room. Yes. Right? 00:57:22 But don't murder her, please. Nobody murder anybody this week, okay? Keep your knives and your hands to yourself and focus on your business. Nobody kill anybody this week or ever. Come on. 00:57:37 But conclusion, no one of the other things we can learn from true crime is that the company you keep is incredibly important and similar to Lit Up a Room, the negative of that is like, well, she fell into the bad crowd or the wrong crowd. And I think the wrong crowd also exists in entrepreneurship big time. It's called a cult. Yeah, there are some cults, and there are also some people that aren't going to have your back when shit hits the fan. And then there are also going to be people that totally do. 00:58:21 Right. So how do we find the right crowd so that if we do get business murdered, someone will call Kelly Siegeler and eventually they'll solve that shit? Right? Somebody's got your back. I think that this is a good question. 00:58:42 I think, again, it goes back to trusting your gut and being willing to really just honor it. Because I know that Amy and I both were in this coaching program, and we both bailed. Like, we had to make a decision. We're either going to keep going with this or we're going to jump ship. And there were lots of people that were, like, questioning whether or not we were making the right decision. 00:59:07 And I just trusted my gut and she trusted hers. And I'm happy to be outside of that. And I don't know, in that situation, it could have kind of make or break you kind of people that were in there. But I was like, I don't want to be associated with this, so I'm out. Well, and you leaned on each other, you bailed together, and it made you stronger. 00:59:30 Right. So sometimes if you're in a crowd and the crowd isn't working for you, maybe you're not the only person who's uncomfortable. Maybe you're not the only person with needs. Maybe you're not the only person who's fed up. I mean, you can commiserate or you can change shit or whatever it can be, but I'm sure that your relationship was I wasn't even there, but I'm sure part of what really galvanized the two of you was jumping out of. 00:59:53 That ship together 100%. That's actually how everything started, was a phone call. Crystal was driving back from having spoken at Lima, at Social Media Week Lima, and she called me on her drive, and we started talking about what was going on. And then out of that, we sort of joked like, we should make a podcast about this. And you did, and that's where it went from. 01:00:24 But definitely that's what solidified or that's what kind of bonded us, was like, we went through this traumatic experience together. In a way past the bullshit, the podcast that came from. This is the true crime of the personal development and online business space. Oh, my God. It is. 01:00:44 You're right. Totally. Yeah. Because you all are exposing some dirty, dirty I mean, maybe it's not true crime, like, snapped murder murder, but maybe it's more of. Like an American greed type, for sure. 01:01:00 We're like a long running documentary about the things of America. About the Murdoch. Yeah, pretty much. There you go. People will be like, what's your podcast? 01:01:13 I'll be like, it's a true crime show about the murders of online business. Yes. That being said, okay, I got a question for each of you and then I want to make sure that they know how to reach you because I could keep you here all day, but you have shit to do. All right? So I'm going to go to Amy and then to Amy and Crystal. 01:01:35 Same question, but Amy first. Alphabetical. Amy, let's say that you do want to lean into your dark, dark, dark impulses. Okay. And you're like, off the rails. 01:01:51 And this has become an episode of snapped killer couples and Crystal is down. Okay? Like, you all are like, we're going to do some shit. What violent murder are you going to commit of an aspect of online marketing or entrepreneurship? Amy, if you could kill something from our industry violently, what would you kill? 01:02:13 Oh, my God. I can only pick one thing to kill. I know. My mind's racing. I'm like, wait a minute. 01:02:21 Honestly, at this point, I would probably kill the content pillars. Like this idea that you have to be stuck, I think it keeps people so stuck. So just going back to that, I would love to murder that concept and never have to hear that again. That's a confession. You all heard it here first. 01:02:41 Heard it here. Content pillars go missing. That goes out of trend. It'll be like, oh, he wants to see namey what's happening? Crystal gosh. 01:02:53 I was going to pretty much say the same thing because we share the same brain. So I'll try to think of something else here, but I wish the exact strategy would die. I wish people would just be honest that I hit the lottery once and this worked for me, but it doesn't mean it'll work for you. But I'm here to help you figure out your, quote, exact strategy to win the lottery. Because honestly, so many people in the online marketing space, I feel like, did hit the lottery once. 01:03:25 They like literally everything aligned. A lot of it was luck and it worked for them. And then they get this idea that they're going to go teach everybody how to do it because that's another thing to monetize, right? And you can't teach someone how you hit the lottery. So when you're hiring someone in marketing, sales, coaching, hire someone who's actually done it more than once. 01:03:46 Amy and I both have different businesses besides a marketing agency. Amy, I'm going to tell everybody you own a real estate brokerage, too. I've done other businesses and run a nonprofit. So what I realized quickly in the online space is some of these people aren't actually business people. They really don't know what they're doing and they're telling their exact strategy just to make money. 01:04:11 So I wish that would die. I wish they follow my exact strategy to winning the lottery would die. So my cautionary tale is really dig in and get to know people. Like, how many businesses have they run? How long have they been doing this? 01:04:27 Are they a one hit wonder like Vanilla Ice or are they something else? How many wives do they have, right? Is that even their real name? Yeah. Are they lip syncing? 01:04:41 Do they use words like greetings? I mean, oh, my God, this has been so morbid and dark and bitchy and wonderful and good for my soul in every possible way. I hope, listeners, that this feels so potent and cathartic, but also permissive. Right? Like we're telling you, you don't need anyone's permission. 01:05:06 But hear the three of us tell you, you have permission not to need anyone's permission. If you're still hanging on there, let's do that final act of liberation and kick you out the nest like you are a survivor. You are a scrapper. Show us. Get out there and show us what you're made of. 01:05:23 Right? The survivors of true crime shows you will never meet more incredible people of your lives. And that's what they did. They're like, I saw an opportunity and I took it. He left the door open once and I bolted. 01:05:34 Like, good for you. Get scrappy with it. So if our listeners know that they need to get scrappy and they know that they need to partner with marketers who are not just going to should all over them, what's the best way for them to start a conversation with one or both of you? So on our website, it is so the way you can remember it is that we really want to resonate. We really want your marketing to resonate with other people and make them say, oh, my God, so true. 01:06:05 So it's you can find contact info or you can just DM us. We're normal human beings. Just send us a DM's all day. I was going to say add us on the socials, Facebook and Instagram. Amy's a big Instagram and I'm old school and love my Facebook. 01:06:23 So if you want to DM me over there, please. Oh, we got the Trice, we got Amy on one, we got Crystal on one, and we got me over on LinkedIn. Okay, there you go. Oh, that's good stuff. But don't send any of us a cold email or I'm going to have Amy mess with you. 01:06:46 Actually, don't send me an email because you'll probably never actually talk to me. You need to send me a DM. My email is basically the baya where everybody dumps their bodies because you might find me there, but you probably won't because your email probably got ate by an alligator. Oh, boy. Well, thank you both for lighting up the room of my podcast today. 01:07:13 I promise that I will only use approved photos and not the ones that they find on true crime shows. Where you're like, who gave them this? Yes, I promise I will only use approved photos. And although you did light up this podcast, I have no will or intention to harm a single hair on either of your beautiful heads. So should anything befall Crystal or Amy audience we know it wasn't me. 01:07:42 Thank you so much, both of you, for being on this wild and wonderful show with me today. Thank you, y'all. I will be back in just a second with my final thought. And your homework for this week, which I promise is not just don't kill anyone this week. Like, we're going to get to work. 01:07:57 So come on back in just a second. J well, hey there. Okay, I admit I watched way too many episodes of Cold Justice as air quotes research for this episode. Largely, I just get so enamored of Detective Kelly and the way that she dives in with her whole being towards solving these cases. And it's really just the Olympics of tenacity and resilience watching these detectives. 01:08:33 And it's not just on cold justice. You'll really see this on any cold case show. It's the dogged determination that provides justice and peace and clarity for the family at the end and nothing else. But I was watching Kelly Siegeler specifically because, as I just said, I freaking love her. And in one episode, she stops and just says, you know, cold cases are never that easy. 01:08:58 It seemed like she was celebrating a possible win. But what I took from it is that there are people in this world every single day who show up knowing full well that their job is going to be so extremely tense or frustrating or scary or dirty or painful or depressing, and yet they show up anyway because they feel called to it. Because they know that someone needs them to do it. Because they know that the world will be better for it. And ain't that a lot like self employment and entrepreneurship? 01:09:41 Cold cases are never that easy. So why then are so many of us struggling through our way of small business expecting that it was supposed to be easy? On one hand, no one at the police academy is running around going, hey, you want to solve murders faster, easier, and with no effort? Maybe from a beach? Why don't you go buy my 999 module program for 29 99 or your first born child? 01:10:11 Right? That is a little bit more unique to our lane and our industry. But there is still this idea of never working a day in your life when you do something you love that excludes when the job is brutal, painful or essential, which sometimes it can be. Now, it's not at all like solving murders, but full disclosure, this week has been pretty crappy and intense for me. It has definitely not been the kind of week that brought me into self employment in the first place. 01:10:44 But let me tell you what got me through it a perfect, perfect way to put a bow on this weird week my partnerships. Specifically, my partner with my number one BFF, Chris DeGrasso, who was also on this project with me. We got to lean on each other. To commiserate, yes, but also to strategize to check up on each other, to get out of our own heads and to hold each other accountable in a peaceful, supportive way. To finishing something that was bringing both of us down. 01:11:18 I leaned on her and she leaned on me. And that's exactly how we got through it. Kelly Siegeler never solves a crime on her own. It takes a literal army of scientists, other detectives, technologists, cell phone companies, everything, you name it. I can't run this business on my own either. 01:11:40 Although I don't have an official partner in my business the way Crystal and Amy do, I have many, many people who lift me up and will walk this path with me. This week, your homework is to get vulnerable and ask one of your partners to talk through something with you, something that's got maybe more emotion tied to it than you normally dive into. Something that's been sitting on your head or your heart like a boulder that just needs to get out of the way. Stop pushing it out all on your own. There are people who want to help you. 01:12:19 You just have to be willing to be vulnerable, tenacious and open enough to get that problem solved. Go out there, have the hard conversations with someone you love, and then don't forget to turn the tables and ask how they can lean on you. 01:12:43 Hey, thanks for listening. If this episode kept you laughing and learning, I have two requests for you. First, make sure you hit that subscribe or Follow button, depending on your platform, so you never miss an episode. And also, more importantly, if you are looking for support, inspiration, networking collaborations, or just a chance to hang out with me, Annie P. Ruggles and our fantastic guests, make sure that you are a member of our LinkedIn community, the legitimate it is a weird and wonderful place. 01:13:18 I can't even believe it's on LinkedIn, and we want you there. You'll find the link in the show notes. Big shout out, as always, to the fabulous dudes who helped me make this show. My producer and editor, Andrew Sims of Hypobool Impact, my theme composer, Riley Horbasio, and my show art creator, Francois Vino. See you next time.